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  1. #1
    Senior Member Tami&amber's Avatar
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    Angry 12 yr old and the death penalty or life sentence?

    I don't know how many of you saw the news last night.
    A 12 year old boy beat and killed a young girl with a baseball bat.

    It made me ill but also got me thinking...

    What do you think of them charging him as an adult?
    and/or seeking the death penalty?
    What about the parents should they be charged... some sites are saying they should be held accountable for thinking that a 12 year old with little impulse control (developmentally as all are) should of known better?

    lastly does your thoughts/views/beliefs change when I tell you that the girl was a 17month old baby?
    The 12 year old did this to stop her from crying.

    Myself I do believe in the death penalty.
    Under certain conditions and while maybe not perfect ...As science furthers itself i do see it as necessity.
    I do believe some criminals -not PPL- criminals -derangled - detached from social morals -should be put to death.
    Again under certain circumstances.
    Understandably the judicial system will NEVER be perfect so where as a society do we see violent crimes and our youth -today?
    Last edited by Tami&amber; 01-08-2008 at 08:50 AM.

    The future is uncertain... but this uncertainty is at the very heart of human creativity

  2. #2
    Senior Member Tami&amber's Avatar
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    A 12-year-old boy has been arrested in Lauderhill, Florida for beating a toddler to death with a baseball bat. The boy confessed to the crime according to police.

    He beat the toddler because she was crying why he was trying to watch television. The boy was at home alone babysitting a 10-year-old and the 17-month-old girl that he beat to death. The young girl’s name was Shaloh Joseph, and she was taken to the hospital after an adult called 911 after some time. The child was pronounced dead at the hospital from blunt force trauma to the head.

    THIS IS THE STORY

    The future is uncertain... but this uncertainty is at the very heart of human creativity

  3. #3
    Expert Forum User The Ultimate London Mom! Mommy2Cuties's Avatar
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    Oh my gosh this makes me sick to my stomach! How can people do that to innocent children?

    I dont know what he should be charged with but I dont think it could be classified as an "accident" it takes a lot of knowledge to go and grab the bat (unless he was watching tv with it in his hands) go up to the child and hit her (probably more than once). The fact that he gave a reason for doing it shows it wasnt one of those "I blacked out and didnt realize it until afterwards" moments....
    I stole Turtle's Lollipop! xoxo

    Nicole, mama to Miss A (April 2005), Miss K (Sept 2007), Angel Baby (August 2008), and Baby A (June 2009)


  4. #4
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    This is horrible! Was the baby a sibling? I horrified that there was a 10 year old there, hopefully asleep and didn't see anything. I can't even imagine the affects this will have on everyone involved.
    ( I don't trust my children to babysitters yet...they are 3 and 18 months....and this is why! We only let family babysit)

    I don't think I would sentence a 12 year old to the death penalty. But would also be affraid of how someone like that at 12 would be at 30. Maybe some serious rehabilitaion?

    I don't know if this is off topic, but I think the young offenders act (in Canada, I'm not sure what it is in the states) should be lowered. It's 18 years old right now, I think if you give poeple a licence at 16 they should know the difference between right and wrong, specially because a car could kill someone if used wrong.

    I wouldn't be opposed to the death penalty for other situations. I think people who sexually abuse small children and use them for child pornography should have a automatic death sentence.
    Last edited by momx2; 01-08-2008 at 09:03 AM.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Tami&amber's Avatar
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    all the 'mitigating circumstances' that people will bring up in this case.

    "He had a troubled childhood"
    "He came from a broken home"
    "He was brought up by a single-mom with no father figure"
    "It wasn't his fault, he just lost control for a moment and he really regrets it now"

    HE USED A BASEBALL BAT AND KILLED THIS LITTLE GIRL!!!!
    Isn't that crazy? I mean he THOUGHT to grab a bat.

    AND THERES THIS CASE TOO Lionel Tate case, that 'troubled boy' who 'accidentally' killed a 6-year-old and was sentenced to life in prison until the bleeding hearts demanded the sentence be tossed was just recently arrested for armed robbery and sentenced to 30 years in prison for 'probation violations'.

    This was in the United States....Florida

    I also believe that the age of majority should change. If you can move out of your parents house, legally quit school, and enter a military educational facility at the age of 16 then YES YES YES you should be looked at as an adult and held accountable for your actions just like an adult.
    Last edited by Tami&amber; 01-08-2008 at 09:44 AM.

    The future is uncertain... but this uncertainty is at the very heart of human creativity

  6. #6
    Zoo
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    The thought of putting a child in prison with adults makes my blood run cold, and the thought of *executing* one I can't even wrap my head around. If that makes me a "bleeding heart" so be it. I'd rather be that than someone who could kill a child, for whatever reason.


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    Expert Forum User The Ultimate London Mom! Mommy2Cuties's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=momx2;111490]

    I don't know if this is off topic, but I think the young offenders act (in Canada, I'm not sure what it is in the states) should be lowered. It's 18 years old right now, I think if you give poeple a licence at 16 they should know the difference between right and wrong, specially because a car could kill someone if used wrong.

    QUOTE]

    I agree. They want to be treated as adults once they get their license in the aspect of the car and everything so why not treat them as adults legally as well?
    I stole Turtle's Lollipop! xoxo

    Nicole, mama to Miss A (April 2005), Miss K (Sept 2007), Angel Baby (August 2008), and Baby A (June 2009)


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    Expert Forum User The Ultimate London Mom! Mommy2Cuties's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoo View Post
    The thought of putting a child in prison with adults makes my blood run cold, and the thought of *executing* one I can't even wrap my head around. If that makes me a "bleeding heart" so be it. I'd rather be that than someone who could kill a child, for whatever reason.
    I agree to a point. Maybe he should have thought about that before he killed her..... but yeah 12 ina huge prison with murderers and beaters does make me a little sick to my stomach (even though technically he did the same)

    Maybe they could keep him in juvie or a really low grade prison until he is 18 and then move him to a "real" prison but unfortunately the way our system works he will probably get out (if tried as a child) when he is 18 and with a clean record (to a degree).

    I hate to say it but this case will probably go on and on for years before they do anything about it. I remember when I lived in Victoria and Reena Virk was killed (I went to school with some of these people) it took them YEARS before they decided anything and I dont think she served any real time for it.

    These parents lost their daughter and will never get her back.... and I know that this boy did it to her but I feel a bit sorry for his parents... in a way they lost their son too.
    I stole Turtle's Lollipop! xoxo

    Nicole, mama to Miss A (April 2005), Miss K (Sept 2007), Angel Baby (August 2008), and Baby A (June 2009)


  9. #9
    Senior Member Tami&amber's Avatar
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    I don't know if a child charged as an adult gets general population lets face it even those criminals have there laws and one is no harm to a child.

    But this boy is a child.... I just can't get past the fact he sought out the baseball bat and used it.

    these type of cases are so sick but I know a slap won't fix it. Which begs another question... what prompted him to get a bat????????????????!!!!!!!!!!

    The future is uncertain... but this uncertainty is at the very heart of human creativity

  10. #10
    Expert Forum User The Ultimate London Mom! Mommy2Cuties's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tami&amber View Post
    what prompted him to get a bat????????????????!!!!!!!!!!
    I have no clue.... obviously he had to know that the bat would hurt the child. Maybe he planned on threatening her with it and of course, being 17 months, she probably had no clue what he was trying to do and wasnt scared so he hit her?

    Not that I condone it at all but I can see shaking a baby out of frustration (ok that came out wrong but hopefully you know what I am trying to say) but a baseball bat???? Wouldnt he have had to LOOK for it... seek it out..... and plan to hit/scare her.... if that doesnt show motive then I am not sure what does.

    Still he is a child and that sickens me but his ACTIONS were something that an adult would do, no?
    I stole Turtle's Lollipop! xoxo

    Nicole, mama to Miss A (April 2005), Miss K (Sept 2007), Angel Baby (August 2008), and Baby A (June 2009)


  11. #11
    Senior Member Tami&amber's Avatar
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    Yes thats what gets me.
    He is a child who sought out a bat
    It doesn't take much to know that a baby is going to be fatally injured if you swing it at them.
    ...further more since he was babysitting he would of been versed on how to take care of (ok maybe not to the degree as an adult) but he would of known that the bat isn't solving anything...
    This 12 year old boy had the presence of mind to seek a bat but NOT the presence of mind to call his parents feeling overwhelmed? -call the parents and lie and say I think your baby is sick...
    Cognitively teens are always in the fight or flight mode. Thats why we find them so difficult. That isn't to say they are naive to what is wrong/right/harmful or intentional.

    The future is uncertain... but this uncertainty is at the very heart of human creativity

  12. #12
    Junior Member Jewels's Avatar
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    I think if it was my 17 month old baby that he killed while I left him and trusted him to care for her. I would want him in jail...for life.
    My son is 13 and he was 12 when my daughter was 17 months he KNOWS that hitting her with a baseball bat will kill her. He should be held accountable as an adult

  13. #13
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    This is just too sad. There's more to this than we'll ever know.

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    Expert Forum User The Ultimate London Mom! mamabear's Avatar
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    I think kids should be charged as kids, and adults should be charged as adults. Makes sense to me.

    This kid needs a team of shrinks more than he needs to be killed. There is obviously something very wrong with him, but he's still only 12 so we don't know yet if it's fixable.

  15. #15
    aveymom
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    This kid needs a team of shrinks more than he needs to be killed. There is obviously something very wrong with him, but he's still only 12 so we don't know yet if it's fixable.
    I could not agree with this more

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