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  1. #16
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    Just to show my ignorance, what would be the appropriate term to use?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mum_of_four View Post
    Just to show my ignorance, what would be the appropriate term to use?
    I believe it would be intersexual.

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    Yeah, intersex.

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    poor individual. worked so hard and for what



  5. #20
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    Yeah, intersex. There is a school of thought that it's really its own gender, and it's much more common than we realize because it's usually hidden. I don't know a ton about it, so don't want to talk out my arse, but I can't think of any part of my life where it could cause me concern on any level.

    Which leaves the whole competitive sport thing, which basically I don't even care about, so that makes it even harder for me to figure out what is “right.“ If being biologically even 'mostly' male gives one an advantage over female competitors, I can't see how it could be allowed. And what would follow? I mean, could any random dude who doesn't make the guys' swimming team slap on a dress and go try out for the girls? I'm being flippant, but you know what I mean.

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    I don`t think she should be given the boot. If she has a natural advantage, then whatever IMO. That`s like putting a cap on how tall basketball players should be. How do they know that most athletes don`t have higher than normal levels of testerone. Unless they plan on testing everyone`s horomone levels to come up with an acceptable range, then I vote she stays.

    Horomone levels are affected by a number of things, working out is one of them. Take the Dad who breastfed, you latch a kid enough times, and the horomones to make bm will follow. Or my Aunt, why does she have a beard and not my Mom. Everyone has different levels.

    The statement that she should get surgery cause it is affecting her heath makes me wanna shake someone.

    (And intersexual is a new term for me too, no idea anything was wrong with hermaphrodite).
    Stop thinking you’re not ready. – Nobody ever feels 100% ready when an opportunity arises. Because most great opportunities in life force us to grow beyond our comfort zones, which means we won’t feel totally comfortable at first.

    ~ Breastfed for 7 months, 2 weeks and 3 days ~

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Colleen View Post
    I don`t think she should be given the boot. If she has a natural advantage, then whatever IMO. That`s like putting a cap on how tall basketball players should be. How do they know that most athletes don`t have higher than normal levels of testerone. Unless they plan on testing everyone`s horomone levels to come up with an acceptable range, then I vote she stays.

    Horomone levels are affected by a number of things, working out is one of them. Take the Dad who breastfed, you latch a kid enough times, and the horomones to make bm will follow. Or my Aunt, why does she have a beard and not my Mom. Everyone has different levels.

    The statement that she should get surgery cause it is affecting her heath makes me wanna shake someone.

    (And intersexual is a new term for me too, no idea anything was wrong with hermaphrodite).
    intersex, not intersexual.

    Excellent, excellent points. Where is the cutoff? Is it a strictly hormonal thing? Can they isolate exactly what it is that is the tipping point of gender advantage and draw the line there? Can they eliminate gender altogether and have A team and B team and go strictly by results? If not, *why* not??

  8. #23
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    OH, and I want to say, I want to punch the gazette because I feel that established media has a duty to use correct terms in reporting a story like this. I wouldn't think badly of anyone here for using the term. I'd probably say 'hey, didja know the preferred term is intersex' but I wouldn't get all up in your grill or anything.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoo View Post
    intersex, not intersexual.

    Excellent, excellent points. Where is the cutoff? Is it a strictly hormonal thing? Can they isolate exactly what it is that is the tipping point of gender advantage and draw the line there? Can they eliminate gender altogether and have A team and B team and go strictly by results? If not, *why* not??
    lol, right intersexual would be something different.

    I don`t know! Lol. It`s a grey area, and I think if you`ve got both and are living as female, then you`re female. I know most people like a nice tidy line with everyone on their correct side, but it`s just not that simple.

    They`re trying to use the horomone level thing here as the justification point, but I think it`s crap. Like I said, everyone`s levels are different and you can`t compare an athlete to an average female. It`s like apples and brocolli.

    Saw some kid who has a genetic `defect`that makes him unusually strong. So his parents are putting him in lots of sports and other parents are mad and think he should not participate. Again, that`s like kicking out all the 7foot+ basketball players. Or claiming that not letting 5`5 90 poun guys play profootball is discrimination.

    I don`t know where the line is. I don`t think there is one as much as most people would like their to be. Now if she wanted to compete in mens division, I`d let her.
    Stop thinking you’re not ready. – Nobody ever feels 100% ready when an opportunity arises. Because most great opportunities in life force us to grow beyond our comfort zones, which means we won’t feel totally comfortable at first.

    ~ Breastfed for 7 months, 2 weeks and 3 days ~

  10. #25
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    exactly, that's what I mean. We get so hung up on gender, when maybe it is an illogical line to draw in sports.

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    She's been in the news a lot over the past few weeks. I'm glad that they're not simply stripping her of her achievements though, even though some would argue that.

    I think the argument is probably to do with the differences in male/female performance (ie, the men run faster, jump higher...) - please do not jump on that as being sexist!!!!!

    It's a whole new situation for the world of sport to deal with, she may not even have known herself for the longest time, I hope they make the right decisions, whatever they are.
    Mummy to two wonderful miracle boys

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    I saw the headline on Achannel this morning and was shocked. That poor woman! I dont need to know that about her, or anyone!

    But I do see the problems in the sports world with this. there is a reason men and women dont compete against eachother. but still, I dont see how publicly 'outing' this woman across the globe helps anything. They could have just let it be, and came up with a solution without anyone ever knowing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dashenka View Post
    I think the argument is probably to do with the differences in male/female performance (ie, the men run faster, jump higher...) - please do not jump on that as being sexist!!!!!.
    Not sexist that there are gender differences. No one is denying that here.

    So, their solution of her having surgery (which is crap IMO), say she removes the internal testes, then is she more female? Is this the source of the higher testerone? I don't know. I think they should just let her be.
    Stop thinking you’re not ready. – Nobody ever feels 100% ready when an opportunity arises. Because most great opportunities in life force us to grow beyond our comfort zones, which means we won’t feel totally comfortable at first.

    ~ Breastfed for 7 months, 2 weeks and 3 days ~

  14. #29
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    I think there are health risks with not dealing with undescended testicles though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoo View Post
    I think there are health risks with not dealing with undescended testicles though.
    Didn't know. Usually in Western medicine when they see both parts at birth parents are pressured to have something removed and undergo a lot of unnecessary testing. I wish they would leave it be until the kid is old enough to decide. I assumed that's why they were saying “surgery!“ here.
    Stop thinking you’re not ready. – Nobody ever feels 100% ready when an opportunity arises. Because most great opportunities in life force us to grow beyond our comfort zones, which means we won’t feel totally comfortable at first.

    ~ Breastfed for 7 months, 2 weeks and 3 days ~

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