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Thread: Measles scare in London!

  1. #31
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    First, many drs are not knowledgeable about vaccines so i wouldnt ask them. They may not have read about them since thy finished school how many years ago-wow not easy to type on iphone! Sorry. I am not talking about nurses. I am talking about the 1 nurse who compiles all the data for windsor essex! Sarnia is not in windsor essex it has a separate health unit. Now i do be believe drs dont really know about vaccines or if something is a reaction and may not feel like contacting the health unit SO those front line people may not deal with it. But people can call the health unit them selves to report. If ur friend went to hospital within 2 weeks of a vaccine for any reason- they dont have to even relate their visit to a vaccine-then their case in 2013 would be reviewed by new peds nurses in canada. I dont believe they report to health unit like everyone else as they are above it but do send reports to the health unit.
    Last edited by melissawilliam; 03-17-2014 at 12:28 PM. Reason: All the horrible spelling from my iphone!

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    Quote Originally Posted by laurensmom View Post
    Agreed.

    And, I personally know someone who was seemingly healthy and had a serious, life threatening reaction to a "safe" vaccine, here in Sarnia....so, IDK where your info (MelissaWilliam) is coming from, but it is not accurate.
    My best friend knows a kid who had a seizure by the time she left the Drs office and sat down in the car. They hadn't even moved yet.
    Last edited by my2babies; 03-17-2014 at 11:20 AM.

  3. #33
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    DP
    Last edited by my2babies; 03-17-2014 at 11:17 AM.

  4. #34
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    Gr, I typed it all but my computer wasn't plugged in and power was low and shut off

    Basically, drs are to report ALL complaints regardless what THEY feel caused it. The complaints on here are that the dr, the person on the front line, isn't accepting the complaint, but they aren't the "higher ups". I feel drs are jack of all trades, masters at none. They know a lot more about medical things than the rest of us, but we still need to see specialists who specialize in 1 area, for a reason. The average dr doesn't know anything more about vaccines than what they read in journals lately (if they keep up on those things) or what they learned in school. The dr has to report the complaint, then of course THEY decide how to proceed with their patient for what needs to be done (if anything) for the issue the person is having.
    If there are seizures, which are very rare, it is to be reported to see if anything comes from it. The risk of seizure on day 8-14 after receiving MMR is 0.00034%, and studies have shown that these are febrile seizures, and have no long term effects, and no increased risk for a 2nd or subsequent seizures. Febrile seizures occur in 4% of the population (regardless of immunization) normally due to a fever from an illness, they leave no long-term effects, main concern is the child could injure themselves when falling or if eating when it happens.
    So, if all kids in London got MMR in any given year it means (given 366,000 people and 16% are 1-14 yo, we can assume about 1.5% are age 1, there are 5,500 infants to get MMR in a given year) 1.87 children (using .00034% which is the bigger quoted %) - or 2 children could have 1 febrile seizure, and 4% or 220 of those children have a seizure when they have a cold with a fever (could potentially have more than 1 seizure), regardless if they vaccinate or not.

    Some vaccines use egg, and this can pose a life-threatening risk to people who are allergic to eggs, that is why they always ask if you are allergic to eggs - I am not sure if they have one that didn't use eggs or if you just can't get the vaccine in that case.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC320893/ 700,000 children were studied! (wow, a good study needs about 367 people)

    http://www.ninds.nih.gov/disorders/f...e_seizures.htm
    Last edited by melissawilliam; 03-17-2014 at 12:51 PM.

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    On the news last night, the outbreak in Alberta is mostly in a community that children have not been vax'ed. I think it is up to the parent, if they chose to vax or not.


    here is a little info from Health unit...

    ....The individual risk of infection is low. Also, individuals who have received two doses of measles vaccine, who have been previously infected or who were born before 1970 are generally protected from infection. However, the Health Unit is asking the community who may have been exposed at the following times and locations to watch for measles symptoms as a precaution

    ....Symptoms:

    Fever, cough and runny nose
    Red, irritated eyes and light sensitivity
    Small white, grey or blue spots in the mouth
    Red, blotchy rash, which is the last symptom to appear. The rash appears on the face and then spreads down over the body, and will begin to fade after about a week
    Last edited by simpsongirl; 03-17-2014 at 12:57 PM.
    NO NOISE IS BETTER THEN HEARING A CHILD'S LAUGHTER

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by simpsongirl View Post
    On the news last night, the outbreak in Alberta is mostly in a community that children have not been vax'ed. I think it is up to the parent, if they chose to vax or not.
    I think that is great, BUT if we are going to make the parents of immune compromised kids keep them at home then I think we should allow nuts in schools and the community, we shouldn't make concessions for those kids cause they aren't more important than kids who are immune compromised. Same with the 5% of kids who get vaccinated but don't end up able to develop an immunity (I worry I am part of this group since I can't develop an immunity to rubella - not sure if there is any correlation to not being able to develop immunity to other things?).
    My son needs hand sanitizer and can't be at school slightly sick so a boy with a compromised immune system can attend (which I fully agree with as everyone should be allowed to attend school).
    Last edited by melissawilliam; 03-17-2014 at 01:01 PM.

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    I will not argue anything on choices that parents make...I have a laid back personality, My son is highly allergic to "acai berries and pomegranate. If even a little bit gets into his system(with in 5-10 min) he gets huge hives all over and his throat swells. if he is to come into contact with them anyone that knows my kid knows to call 911. His allergy is very rare...Dr. Kloth's 1st kid to have a health berries allergy.
    Point I am getting at is I will not stop him from living a normal life because of this I WILL educated my DS on products he can touch and ones he can not have. Same with other parents educating themselves on what is best for there family.
    my2babies likes this.
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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by simpsongirl View Post
    I will not argue anything on choices that parents make...I have a laid back personality, My son is highly allergic to "acai berries and pomegranate. If even a little bit gets into his system(with in 5-10 min) he gets huge hives all over and his throat swells. if he is to come into contact with them anyone that knows my kid knows to call 911. His allergy is very rare...Dr. Kloth's 1st kid to have a health berries allergy.
    Point I am getting at is I will not stop him from living a normal life because of this I WILL educated my DS on products he can touch and ones he can not have. Same with other parents educating themselves on what is best for there family.
    HOW do you educate your child on that? Measles wouldn't show up until they are more than a little sick. Sure, you can teach them if a child coughs near them to run to the office and call home - but that is extreme and they would never be able to be in school. My son has allergies, so coughs a lot, but never gets sicks, but the boy in his class would have to call home 2 weeks out of each month. Plus, most illnesses are MOST contagious before you develop symptoms.

    HOW can a parent teach their child to perceive if another person is going to develop a serious illness - if that person doesn't even know they have caught something yet???

    Something simple, like, don't eat nuts or berries, and here are foods that have them, and here are labels and what to look for is a lot easier, and realistic.

    BBC News - Swansea measles: Epidemic tops 1,000 cases I guess it isn't really that bad. I mean UK's average immunization rates dropped really low - down to only 80% immunized (some areas as low as 50%), and they ended up with only 1,011 cases of Measles (and the 2 deaths were found to be unrelated to their measles), and only 84 hospitalizations. That isn't too bad - of course thousands were immunized last March to prevent the rapid spread (in 8 weeks went from 200 to 1,000 cases!) so if mass immunization hadn't taken place it may have ended much worse.


    http://o.canada.com/health/low-rate-...ns-in-ontario/
    Last edited by melissawilliam; 03-17-2014 at 02:38 PM. Reason: 1 person did die, 70,000 immunizations occurred in 2 months,

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    I just dont understand the reasoning. I cant wrap my head around it. I probably wont get in accident today but i'm going to wear my seat belt, even if it might chafe my neck.

  10. #40
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    Melissa we all have our things we think other people do that could affect us. For me I think if a person is not going GMO free then they are part of why they keep producing them. If we all took a stand they would get them out of our food. If you watch genetic roulette and see all the health conditions that have gone up since the introduction I think you'd be hard pressed to say you feel comfortable with them. Many of the farmer's commit suicide in India because they become what I would call enslaved to them. They can't save GMO seeds, they have to re-buy them every year. They are in debt many of them it's a vicious cycle and they are afraid since the chemicals are so harsh needed for the GMO's that they wouldn't be able to grow non GMO seeds on the land after. Do you know that 70-80% of what is in the grocery stores is a GMO? Many people don't. It's frustrating to me but I am not going to say your all uneducated and you could hurt my children with your choices if you don't have my same view point on it.

    Also Fluoride, I think it's dangerous and you don't. I can't control what you think is safe or not, and I can perceive since I think it's dangerous and you don't then you're part of the problem because you're not wanting it out.(I don't. I realize you think it's a good thing) If all parents could unite on that and demand it out, they'd take it out. Really though we are all individuals, we all make choices that we feel are best for us LIVE AND LET LIVE.

    .
    Last edited by my2babies; 03-17-2014 at 02:58 PM.

  11. #41
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    I guess that is also for Katie and Nananana. People shut down once you start talking rudely. In going over it Melissa actually I see you were making some good points.

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    I think researching this has helped me to realize that it doesn't really affect me and isn't a big deal. It appears Canada has 94% coverage for Measles for routine immunization (and 98% of the population has been immunized), and there are online reports about Alberta and Saskatchewan because they have areas much below herd immunity rates (only 80% are immunizing). I am pretty sure those are what the stats meant that I was reading. I couldn't find any numbers for London or Ontario only. I had read something that said we fall just below the 95% herd immunity rate, so if 6% of people are not immunizing that isn't a big deal when looking at the UK, where 20-50% of given populations chose not to immunize and then 10 years after so many people stopped immunizing (unless they had a $1,000 to get M and M and R separate like the autism study guy wanted them to do) that they reached such low levels and had so many issues.

    I see the likelihood of us developing an epidemic as quite low, and if we do it likely won't be for a few years and only if our rates keep dropping, and since my kids (young adults/teens?) are immunized, even if they end up being able to catch measles it would be mild, so they wouldn't be the 10% with complications or the .01% who die.
    I realize if I had a child with health issues I would be upset with others, but in reality I don't have time to be fight for those who have those children, and change usually comes from those parents once their child dies and they get mad (like when 1 set of parents forced the gov to pay for meningitis, rather than selling it to them).

    Honestly, I thought we had a higher level of people not vaccinating their kids, but 6% of people is still really small (despite everything I am reading saying anything over 5% is too big), so I don't see it as a big deal anymore.

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    I am a masters prepared, nurse practitioner trained nurse. I choose not to vaccinate my children and find some of these comments very insulting.
    Last edited by Chantelle; 03-17-2014 at 04:08 PM.

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    I dont see any rude comments? I'm asking legit questions so I can understand the other side. No one should be insulted, I'm not insulted when people say vaccines are poison, because I'm comfortable with my decision.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Katie_ View Post
    I dont see any rude comments? I'm asking legit questions so I can understand the other side. No one should be insulted, I'm not insulted when people say vaccines are poison, because I'm comfortable with my decision.
    But you might be insulted if someone posted that immunizations are poison and that anyone who chose to immunize their child was misinformed or uneducated in their decisions.....which is one of the insulting comments made here, about those who choose not to immunize.
    "Anything is better than lies and deceit". Leo Tolstoy

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